The women missing from music

Episode of TED Radio Hour · October 2, 2026 · 50 min

Manoush Zomorodi talks with soprano Gabriella Di Laccio about forgotten women composers and AI, then airs Nadya Tolokonnikova's TED Talk on Pussy Riot's resistance.

Summary

In this TED Radio Hour episode, host Manoush Zomorodi interviewed Brazilian-born classical singer Gabriella Di Laccio about the women left out of music history. Di Laccio recounted discovering the International Encyclopedia of Women Composers at a London book market in 2016, which listed some 6,000 women composers, and her surprise that neither she nor her colleagues knew of them. She described launching a website called Donne on International Women's Day 2018, alongside a count showing that only 2.3% of the music played by 15 top orchestras was written by women; the project grew into the Donne Foundation, whose database she said now includes more than 18,000 composers.

Di Laccio attributed the erasure to unequal access to education, poor record keeping, male-written histories and the lack of published scores, arguing that unpublished music cannot easily be recorded and therefore remains unheard. She highlighted Francesca Caccini, Ilse Weber (whose songs written in the Theresienstadt ghetto were buried and recovered after the war), Marianna Martines and Florence Price. She stressed that the goal was to enlarge the canon rather than remove Mozart or Beethoven, and discussed Dolly Parton's visibility and the improving but still limited share of women on pop charts.

The conversation turned to artificial intelligence, with Di Laccio warning that AI trained on a predominantly male catalog would replicate and accelerate the erasure of women's voices. Zomorodi suggested an AI model trained only on women composers, which Di Laccio welcomed as an experiment, while maintaining that living human artists must also be supported.

The episode closed with Nadya Tolokonnikova's 2023 TED Talk, in which she described her 2012 imprisonment after Pussy Riot's protest performance in Moscow's Cathedral of Christ the Saviour, the group's later projects including MediaZona and fundraising for Ukraine, her placement on Russia's most wanted list, and her argument that courage is contagious.

Chapters

0:18
Introduction and Di Laccio's path to opera
Zomorodi introduces the theme and Di Laccio describes growing up singing in southern Brazil and falling in love with classical music and Mozart.
3:30
Discovering the encyclopedia of women composers
Di Laccio recounts finding a 1980s encyclopedia of 6,000 women composers in London and launching the Donne website with an orchestra programming count.
8:29
Why women composers were forgotten
Di Laccio explains how lack of education, poor records and male-written histories erased women such as Francesca Caccini.
14:31
Building the database and Ilse Weber's lullaby
Di Laccio describes the expanding Donne database and the story of Ilse Weber, whose Theresienstadt compositions were buried and recovered.
19:00
Marianna Martines and the publishing problem
Di Laccio explains how unpublished scores keep women's music from being recorded and heard.
21:54
Florence Price and expanding the canon
Di Laccio discusses the rediscovery of Florence Price's manuscripts and argues for adding composers rather than removing canonical ones.
26:27
Dolly Parton and women in pop
Zomorodi and Di Laccio discuss Dolly Parton's visibility and the share of women on pop charts and in songwriting.
30:24
Performing rediscovered music
Di Laccio describes the experience of performing long-unheard works and the importance of familiarity for audiences.
34:50
AI and the future of music
Di Laccio warns that AI trained on male-dominated catalogs could deepen erasure, and the two discuss an AI trained solely on women composers.
41:30
Nadya Tolokonnikova's TED Talk
Tolokonnikova recounts Pussy Riot's cathedral protest, her imprisonment, the group's later activism and her call for courage.

Key points

What was said, by whom, with the exact words. Timestamps jump to the moment.

Gabriella Di Laccio
Di Laccio says her count of the top 15 orchestras found only 2.3% of the music they played was written by women.
“I published a tiny infographic and it said only 2.3% of these orchestras, the music these orchestras played was written by women”
Listen from 6:42 · Gender representation in orchestral programming
Gabriella Di Laccio
Di Laccio suggests that male authors of history books chose not to preserve women's contributions.
“who was writing the history books? A lot of men were in charge, I guess, and perhaps they didn't think we should keep this”
Listen from 9:30 · Women composers
Gabriella Di Laccio
Di Laccio argues that women composers were first neglected because they lacked equal access to education and were considered inferior.
“initially women didn't have the same access to education. They were considered to be less than men”
Listen from 9:33 · Women composers
Linked moment · 10:41Skip to 10:41 using a listen link in the info box.
Gabriella Di Laccio
Di Laccio argues that this erasure creates an unconscious bias leading people to assume women did not create music.
“That creates an unconscious bias on all of us because we grow up not knowing and we grow up just accepting like I did”
Listen from 10:41 · Women composers
Gabriella Di Laccio
Di Laccio reports that the foundation has identified more than 18,000 women composers, with over 10,000 already on its website.
“So we have found more than 18,000 now. I think the website currently has over 10,000”
Listen from 16:14 · Donne Foundation
Gabriella Di Laccio
Di Laccio says that after learning Ilse Weber's story she decided any woman with even one recorded composition belongs on the list.
“I don't care if a woman wrote one piece of music. If I can find the record is going on the website, is going on the list”
Listen from 19:32 · Donne Foundation
Gabriella Di Laccio
Di Laccio argues that because much women's music is unpublished it goes unrecorded, leaving a vast imbalance compared with works like Beethoven's symphonies.
“because it's not properly published, it's not recorded. And then we have 1,500 recordings of Beethoven symphonies of the same ones”
Listen from 20:13 · Music publishing
Gabriella Di Laccio
Di Laccio insists her goal is to expand the canon rather than reduce performances of composers like Mozart.
“It's not about taking people off the list. Yes. It's putting more people on the list”
Listen from 25:28 · Women composers
Manoush Zomorodi
Zomorodi notes that the share of women on Billboard Hot 100 charts has risen from about 22-23 percent to around a third.
“it's gone up from about 22 percent, 23 percent women on those charts. And now it's around like a third or so”
Listen from 28:36 · Women in the music industry
Gabriella Di Laccio
Di Laccio acknowledges progress but says the music industry remains male-dominated and still treats women poorly.
“But the music industry is still very male. It's still, you hear From different experiences, still things happening that are not the best for women”
Listen from 29:25 · Women in the music industry
Gabriella Di Laccio
Di Laccio argues that audiences love Mozart partly through familiarity, a privilege forgotten women composers lack.
“We have the chance to have familiarity. These women don't get that privilege anymore. So familiarity is needed”
Listen from 31:05 · Women composers
Gabriella Di Laccio
Di Laccio criticizes AI music generation for not paying royalties to the artists whose work it draws on.
“AI creates new music. It doesn't pay any royalties to the people whose music it's using to create”
Listen from 35:32 · Artificial intelligence
Gabriella Di Laccio
Di Laccio warns that AI trained on a male-dominated catalog will reproduce the erasure of women's voices at greater speed.
“Otherwise, we're just going to replicate this image erasure of the women's voices at, you know, much faster scale”
Listen from 35:32 · Artificial intelligence
Gabriella Di Laccio
Di Laccio believes people will increasingly crave live, human-made music and that living artists must be supported.
“We must continue to support living artists because I think in 10 years time, We will crave live music done by people”
Listen from 39:48 · Artificial intelligence
Nadya Tolokonnikova
Tolokonnikova says the cathedral performance was a response to Putin's announcement that he intended to rule Russia indefinitely.
“We did it in response to Putin's announcement that he wants to rule Russia pretty much indefinitely”
Listen from 42:30 · Pussy Riot punk prayer at Cathedral of Christ the Saviour
Nadya Tolokonnikova
Tolokonnikova says Pussy Riot raised $7 million for Ukraine in two days in 2022 and close to $1 million for Planned Parenthood.
“In 2022, we raised $7 million in two days for Ukraine. When reproductive rights became under attack in the United States, we raised close to $1 million for Planned Parenthood”
Listen from 46:05 · Pussy Riot
Nadya Tolokonnikova
Tolokonnikova recounts being placed on Russia's most wanted list in March 2023 and facing new charges over her art.
“In March 2023, I was put on Russia's most wanted list. I'm facing new criminal charges for the art I made”
Listen from 47:16 · Pussy Riot
Nadya Tolokonnikova
Tolokonnikova argues she became a threat to the Russian system not through power but because courage spreads.
“The reason why I became a threat to the system, not because of any actual physical power that I have, but because courage is contagious”
Listen from 47:16 · Pussy Riot

People

In the conversation

Manoush ZomorodiHost of NPR's TED Radio Hour
Gabriella Di LaccioBrazilian-born classical soprano and founder of the Donne Foundation, which documents women composers
Nadya TolokonnikovaRussian artist, activist and founding member of the feminist punk group Pussy Riot, heard via her 2023 TED Talk

Discussed

Ilse WeberCzech Jewish poet and composer who wrote songs in the Theresienstadt ghetto and died at Auschwitz
Florence PriceAmerican composer, first African-American woman to have a symphony performed by a major orchestra
Marianna Martines18th-century Viennese composer associated with Mozart
Francesca CacciniBaroque composer at the Medici court, regarded as the first woman to write an opera
Aaron I. CohenCompiler of the International Encyclopedia of Women Composers
Rachel PortmanBritish composer, first woman to win an Oscar for composing
Dolly PartonAmerican country music singer-songwriter who recorded with The Highwomen
Wolfgang Amadeus MozartClassical composer cited as Di Laccio's early favorite
Vladimir PutinPresident of Russia
Vladimir Kara-MurzaRussian opposition politician sentenced to 25 years for condemning the war in Ukraine

Topics

From the publisher

Women have been writing music for centuries. Why do we know so few of them today? This hour, TED speakers explore the role of women in music history and how we can remember their contributions. Guests include opera singer and activist Gabriella Di Laccio and Nadya Tolokonnikova, a Russian artist and founder of Pussy Riot. Support public media with NPR+ and enjoy perks for over 25 podcasts like this one. This show’s perks include sponsor-free listening. Learn more at plus.npr.org . See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for sponsorship and to manage your podcast sponsorship preferences. NPR Privacy Policy

Summary, chapters and key points were generated from the episode transcript on November 1, 2026. Quotes are checked word for word against the transcript.

Categories: Music History·Society & Culture