Messi Takes England Out of the World Cup, Plus Preparing for Christopher Nolan’s 'The Odyssey' With Ian Wright, Anthony Dabbundo, and Sean Fennessey
Episode of The Bill Simmons Podcast · July 16, 2026 · 1 h 51 min
Guest host Chris Ryan discusses England's World Cup semifinal loss to Argentina with Ian Wright, previews the Spain–Argentina final with Anthony Dabbundo, and talks Christopher Nolan's 'The Odyssey' with Sean Fennessey.
Summary
Chris Ryan, filling in for Bill Simmons, opened with former Arsenal and England striker Ian Wright to react to Argentina's 2-1 semifinal win over England at the 2026 FIFA World Cup. Wright criticized Thomas Tuchel's decision to switch to a defensive 5-4-1 after England took the lead, arguing it was a structural problem despite Tuchel's denial, and praised Lionel Messi's game intelligence in drifting to the right wing to supply crosses. Wright urged England to build around Jude Bellingham, called Cape Verde's run the highlight of the tournament, and picked Argentina to win the final.
Anthony Dabbundo then discussed Spain's win over France, arguing that Didier Deschamps never coordinated a press and that France's heavy schedule in extreme outdoor heat hurt them. Ryan and Dabbundo discussed the difficulties of international management, Spain's club-like cohesion under Luis de la Fuente, and Argentina's knack for late wins. Both leaned toward Spain in the final while expressing reluctance to count out Argentina.
In the final segment, Ryan and Sean Fennessey held a mostly spoiler-free conversation about Christopher Nolan's The Odyssey. They discussed IMAX 70mm as an eventized format, agreed Nolan is the definitive filmmaker of the century, and credited editor Jennifer Lame with changing his style. They compared Nolan to Kubrick, Spielberg, Scorsese, Michael Mann and Denis Villeneuve, discussed casting including Matt Damon and Tom Holland, and weighed the film's awards prospects.
Chapters
- 0:06
Intro
Chris Ryan introduces himself as guest host and previews the World Cup and Odyssey segments.
- 2:30
Tuchel's defensive gamble
Ian Wright criticizes England's retreat into a defensive shell after scoring against Argentina.
- 8:38
Messi's game intelligence and building around Bellingham
Wright praises Messi's role in the win and argues England should build around Jude Bellingham.
- 20:21
Argentina's gamesmanship and the tournament experience
Wright discusses Argentina's physical tactics, his time in New York, and Cape Verde's memorable run before picking Argentina for the final.
- 34:05
England and Spain's win over France
Anthony Dabbundo analyzes England's collapse and why Spain outplayed Deschamps' France.
- 38:26
International management and final preview
Ryan and Dabbundo discuss managerial pressure, Spain's cohesion, Argentina's resilience and pick Spain narrowly.
- 54:39
The Odyssey and the IMAX experience
Ryan and Sean Fennessey discuss IMAX 70mm, eventized moviegoing and theater seating.
- 1:02:20
Nolan as filmmaker of the century
The two assess Nolan's career, his editing style with Jennifer Lame, and how The Odyssey adapts Homer.
- 1:16:14
Nolan's peers and forebears
They compare Nolan to Spielberg, Scorsese, Villeneuve, Kubrick and Michael Mann.
- 1:30:45
Actors in Nolan films
Discussion of Nolan's casting, Robert Pattinson, Tom Holland and Zendaya.
- 1:38:08
Awards prospects and guest-hosting banter
Fennessey weighs The Odyssey's Oscar chances, and they joke about guest hosts and would-be guests.
Key points
What was said, by whom, with the exact words. Timestamps jump to the moment.
- Ian Wright
Wright argued that England's defensive switch to a 5-4-1 after scoring could not work against Argentina.
“His strategy to bring on the defensive guys in the 5-4-1, it's not going to work”
- Ian Wright
Wright said Messi winning a second consecutive World Cup would likely be the greatest achievement by any player.
“probably in respects of achievement, that would go down as the greatest achievement by any player, for him to have two out of all the so-called goats”
- Ian Wright
Wright rejected Tuchel's claim that the loss was not a structural problem.
“It was a structure problem, if you ask me, because we couldn't get out”
- Ian Wright
Wright argued England should build its attack around Jude Bellingham, as Argentina does around Messi.
“absolutely we should be looking to say listen this is the main guy and we want the main guy up there”
Linked moment · 24:47Skip to 24:47 using a listen link in the info box.
Ian WrightWright predicted Argentina would target Lamine Yamal with rough treatment in the final.
“I can say for definite right now that Lamin Yamal will get some form of rough treatment”
- Ian Wright
Wright named Cape Verde's match against Argentina the best game of the World Cup.
“Cape Verde's game against Argentina for me is the best game of this World Cup for me so far”
- Ian WrightDidn’t happen
Wright picked Argentina to win the World Cup final.
“I'm probably going to go with Argentina simply because I just feel that they just can't be beat”
- Anthony Dabbundo
Dabbundo argued France was hurt by playing outdoor games in extreme heat and by Deschamps never coordinating a press.
“Deschamps has never, ever coordinated a press, never, ever coordinated a counter press”
- Anthony Dabbundo
Dabbundo argued Argentina have been poor at protecting leads, making a close finish likely.
“Going back to the last World Cup, the Copa, they are bad with a lead”
- Chris RyanCame true
Ryan said he would pick Spain in the final, as he had since before the tournament.
“I'm going to go Spain because it's been Spain for me since before the tournament”
- Anthony Dabbundo
Dabbundo said Spain should be and will be the favorite in the final while cautioning against counting out Argentina.
“I do think Spain should, is, and will be the favorite going into Sunday”
- Sean Fennessey
Fennessey argued that fewer, more comfortable premium seats are an underreported reason movies have regained momentum.
“I do think this is an underreported component of why movies are back a little bit”
- Sean Fennessey
Fennessey agreed that Nolan is the definitive filmmaker of the century and said this is no longer controversial.
“Yes, and I don't even think it's controversial anymore”
- Sean Fennessey
Fennessey attributed his growing appreciation of Nolan's recent films to editor Jennifer Lame's influence on his style.
“I think it's because he changed editors. And Jennifer Lame is his editor now. And with Jennifer Lame, he's changed his filmmaking style”
- Chris RyanPrediction · due Dec 2026
Ryan predicted The Odyssey would probably gross a billion dollars and be the year's biggest film.
“this movie's going to make a billion dollars probably and be the biggest film of the year probably”
- Chris Ryan
Ryan contrasted Kubrick and Nolan, saying Kubrick's films prompt existential questions while Nolan's prompt thoughts about the film itself.
“you can still watch Kubrick movies and it makes you question things about existence. And when you watch Nolan movies, I think you think about the Nolan movie you just watched”
- Sean Fennessey
Fennessey said Tom Holland's performance as Telemachus was the weakest part of the film for him.
“least effective part of the movie for me”
- Sean Fennessey
Fennessey called The Odyssey an awards contender and suggested competing films like Dune Part 3 and Project Hail Mary would help it stand out.
“I mean, it's an awards contender for sure. It's fascinating to think about him pulling the Coppola”
People
In the conversation
- Chris RyanThe Ringer podcaster and TV/film critic
- Ian WrightFormer Arsenal and England striker and UK football pundit
- Anthony DabbundoRinger sports-betting and soccer analyst, co-host of The Ringer Gambling Show
- Sean FennesseyThe Ringer film writer, host of The Big Picture and New York Knicks fan
Discussed
- Lionel MessiArgentine footballer and World Cup winner
- Thomas TuchelGerman manager of the England national team
- Jude BellinghamEnglish midfielder for Real Madrid and England
- Harry KaneEngland striker who missed a chance in a 0-0 draw with Ghana
- Lautaro MartínezArgentine striker who scored the winner against England
- Lamine YamalSpanish soccer star who scored his first World Cup goal
- Didier DeschampsLongtime manager of the France national team
- Luis de la FuenteManager of the Spain national team
- Lionel ScaloniManager of the Argentina national team
- Christopher NolanBritish-American film director adapting the Odyssey for the screen
- Jennifer LameFilm editor who has cut Nolan's recent films
- Matt DamonAmerican actor cast as Odysseus in Nolan's film
- Tom HollandEnglish actor cast as Telemachus
- Robert PattinsonEnglish actor who played Edward Cullen
- Stanley KubrickAmerican filmmaker compared to Nolan
- Heath LedgerLate Australian actor who played the Joker in The Dark Knight
Topics
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From the publisher
In this special episode of The Bill Simmons Podcast, guest host Chris Ryan is joined by Arsenal legend Ian Wright to react to Argentina defeating England 2-1 in the World Cup semifinals. Then, Anthony Dabbundo joins the pod to preview the World Cup final between Spain and Argentina. Finally, Sean Fennessey hops on to talk ‘The Odyssey’ and Christopher Nolan. (0:00) Intro (2:15) Argentina eliminates England, with Ian Wright (34:05) World Cup final preview with Anthony Dabbundo (54:39) Sean Fennessey on ‘The Odyssey’ Host: Chris Ryan Guests: Ian Wright, Anthony Dabbundo, and Sean Fennessey Producers: Chia Hao Tat, Eduardo Ocampo, and Chris Wohlers As the Official Beer Sponsor of the FIFA World Cup 26, Michelob ULTRA away $1million in FIFA World Cup tickets and prizes. https://www.michelobultra.com/superioraccess/FIFAWORLDCUP26 MICHELOB ULTRA® FIFA® WORLD CUP 26TM SUPERIOR ACCESS. No Purchase Necessary. Open to US residents 21+. Begins on 12/1/25 and ends on 7/31/26. Multiple entry periods. Visit https://www.michelobultra.com/superioraccess/FIFAWORLDCUP26 for free entry, entry deadlines, and Official Rules. Message and data rates may apply. Void where prohibited. The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit https://fanduel.com/playwithaplan to learn more about the resources and helplines Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
Summary, chapters and key points were generated from the episode transcript on September 30, 2026. Quotes are checked word for word against the transcript.