The Splintering MAGA Media Rage Machine

Episode of Pod Save America · June 7, 2026 · 1 h 3 min

Tommy Vietor and The Bulwark's Will Sommer survey the fracturing MAGA media world, from Candace Owens and Tucker Carlson to the Daily Wire, manosphere streamers and far-right candidates.

Summary

Tommy Vietor interviewed Will Sommer, author of The Bulwark's False Flag newsletter, about how right-wing media figures are positioning themselves for a post-Trump Republican Party. They began with Candace Owens, whom Sommer described as an antisemitic conspiracy theorist whose claims about Charlie Kirk's assassination have damaged Turning Point USA, and Tucker Carlson, whom Sommer saw as uniquely able to straddle the MAGA mainstream and the insurgent far right and as the media figure most likely to run for president in 2028.

Sommer characterized Megyn Kelly's criticism of Trump as mercenary, attributed the Daily Wire's decline to costly entertainment ventures and Ben Shapiro's awkward ideological position, and said the Free Press was drifting as Bari Weiss focused on CBS News. He argued that interest in anti-woke content has declined with Democrats out of power.

The conversation turned to the extremist fringe and manosphere, including Nick Fuentes, Chud the Builder, Clavicular, Andrew Tate and Sneako, the platforms such as Kick and Rumble that host them, and the degree of Steve Bannon's influence. Sommer agreed with Ashley St. Clair that much right-wing influencer content is paid, citing a sudden campaign against Harley-Davidson. They also discussed James O'Keefe's sting operations, James Fishback's Florida gubernatorial campaign, and Greg Bovino's appearance at a remigration conference.

Asked who concerned him most, Sommer named Candace Owens for mainstreaming antisemitism, while Vietor added Fuentes; Sommer warned that such views are taking hold among young Republicans.

Chapters

0:21
Introduction: MAGA media fracturing
Vietor frames the episode as a battle for the future of the MAGA movement fought in podcasts and streams, and introduces Will Sommer.
1:34
Candace Owens
Sommer explains Owens's conspiracy-driven content, her feud with Turning Point USA, her income and her legal exposure.
8:55
Tucker Carlson
They discuss Carlson's career, his break with Trump over Iran and Israel, and whether he might run for president.
14:54
How Sommer got on the beat
Sommer describes his background as a teen Republican in Texas and how he came to cover right-wing media.
19:56
Megyn Kelly's pivot
Sommer calls Kelly's newfound criticism of Trump a mercenary reading of which way the wind is blowing.
22:00
The Daily Wire's decline
Sommer attributes the Daily Wire's troubles to expensive projects like The Pendragon Cycle and Ben Shapiro's unpopular positioning.
Linked moment · 26:15Skip to 26:15 using a listen link in the info box.
26:15
The Free Press and anti-woke fatigue
They discuss the Free Press's drift under Bari Weiss and a broader decline in interest in anti-woke content.
31:14
The extremist fringe and platforms
Sommer describes Nick Fuentes, Chud the Builder and Clavicular, how to gauge their reach, and platforms like Kick and Rumble.
37:26
Manosphere and crossover audiences
They cover Clavicular, Andrew Tate, Sneako and Myron Gaines and how audiences migrate between gossip, meme stocks and conspiracy.
44:59
Steve Bannon and policy splits
Sommer says Bannon's influence is overstated and identifies AI and Israel as emerging fault lines on the right.
48:37
Paid influencers
Sommer agrees with Ashley St. Clair that much right-wing content is paid, citing a campaign against Harley-Davidson.
53:15
Stings, Fishback and Bovino
They discuss James O'Keefe's honeytrap stings, James Fishback's Florida governor run and Greg Bovino at a remigration conference.
1:00:17
Who worries them most
Sommer names Candace Owens and Vietor adds Nick Fuentes, with Sommer warning about young Republicans.

Key points

What was said, by whom, with the exact words. Timestamps jump to the moment.

Will Sommer
Sommer argues that Candace Owens and conspiracy theorists around her have substantially damaged Turning Point USA.
“I think Candace and sort of the conspiracy theorists around her have actually done a lot of damage to Turning Point”
Listen from 7:09 · Turning Point USA
Will Sommer
Sommer doubts Owens will run for office because her media business is so lucrative.
“She's making tens of thousands of dollars per video. She's putting out four or five videos a week”
Listen from 8:10
Will Sommer
Sommer suggests defamation lawsuits could eventually catch up with Owens as they did with Alex Jones.
“just as Alex Jones was able to avoid it until he couldn't, I think she could face the same issue”
Listen from 8:48
Will Sommer
Sommer argues Tucker Carlson straddles the MAGA mainstream and the far right, letting him mainstream hateful ideas.
“he's sort of uniquely able there to mainstream these really hateful and toxic ideas like having Nick Fuentes on his show”
Listen from 10:46 · Tucker Carlson interview of Nick Fuentes
Will Sommer
Sommer believes Carlson's firing from Fox News radicalized him toward more extreme politics.
“being fired from Fox News really sort of radicalized him and sort of caused him to seek out these more extreme politics”
Listen from 12:44
Will Sommer
Sommer sees an open anti-war populist lane in 2028 and considers Carlson the media figure most likely to run.
“I think he's the one I see most likely as potentially running”
Listen from 14:15 · 2028 Republican Party presidential primaries
Will Sommer
Sommer characterizes Megyn Kelly's turn against Trump as more mercenary than Carlson's.
“I would say Megyn Kelly is much more mercenary even than Tucker Carlson is”
Listen from 21:09
Will Sommer
Sommer says Ben Shapiro's cautious pro-Trump, pro-Israel, pro-Iran-war stance is unpopular on the right and costing him audience.
“I think that point of view is just not that popular right now on the right. And it's losing him”
Listen from 22:46 · The Daily Wire
Will Sommer
Sommer predicts The Daily Wire will shrink into a podcast-centered outlet rather than a conservative entertainment giant.
“The Daily Wire will probably retrench as something more like The Daily Call or like Steven Crowder”
Listen from 25:31 · The Daily Wire
Will Sommer
Sommer argues that demand for anti-woke content has fallen with Trump in power and Democrats out of office.
“I think there's been a decline in interest in anti-woke content”
Listen from 28:49 · The Free Press
Will Sommer
Sommer gauges fringe figures' genuine reach by real-world signals, such as Chud the Builder's fundraising after a shooting.
“Or when Chud the Builder, unfortunately, raises 300 grand after shooting a guy. I mean, clearly there's some amount of genuine support”
Listen from 34:50 · Manosphere
Will Sommer
Sommer believes Steve Bannon's influence is overstated because he is an easy source for journalists.
“I think it's often sort of overstated because I think he's a pretty easy source for journalists”
Listen from 45:53
Will Sommer
Sommer expects fights on the right over AI and Israel to become more open as Trump's influence recedes.
“So I think as Trump kind of recedes in influence, I think this fight is going to break out more in the open”
Listen from 48:31
Will Sommer
Sommer agrees with Ashley St. Clair that pay-to-play arrangements are widespread among right-wing influencers.
“I think there's like a huge amount of pay to play or payola washing around”
Listen from 49:29 · Paid influencer campaigns
Will Sommer
Sommer believes a sudden influencer campaign calling Harley-Davidson woke was a paid effort, though he has not proven it.
“I haven't proven it, but I think it's clear that this is a paid campaign”
Listen from 50:07 · Paid influencer campaigns
Will Sommer Came true
Sommer predicts James Fishback will not win the Florida Republican primary despite drawing larger crowds than Byron Donalds.
“i don't think he's going to win but if you look at you know byron donald's events kind of lackluster”
Listen from 56:00 · 2026 Florida gubernatorial election
Tommy Vietor
Vietor says the remigration concept is too extreme even for France's National Rally.
“this re-migration concept, I mean, it's too extreme even for like Marine Le Pen and the National Rally Party in France”
Listen from 59:47 · Remigration
Will Sommer
Sommer names Candace Owens as the most concerning figure for mainstreaming antisemitism to otherwise liberal audiences.
“my mind just instantly jumps to Candace Owens, who I think has done a lot to, you know, mainstream anti-Semitism”
Listen from 1:00:35 · Antisemitism
Tommy Vietor
Vietor worries Nick Fuentes reaches many young fraternity members and that his humor obscures neo-Nazi views.
“I think that there's a lot of young kids in fraternities at SEC schools who are listening to Nick Fuentes”
Listen from 1:01:09
Will Sommer
Sommer warns that racist views promoted by figures like Fuentes are taking hold among young Republicans, the party's future.
“I think those views are really sinking in with young Republicans”
Listen from 1:02:04

People

In the conversation

Tommy VietorCo-host of Pod Save America and Pod Save the World who conducted the Josh Turek interview
Will SommerReporter at The Bulwark who wrote about Bill Pulte

Discussed

Candace OwensConservative commentator and podcaster cited as a top-ranked show
Tucker CarlsonConservative broadcaster cited as part of right-wing media
Charlie KirkAmerican conservative activist and podcast host assassinated in September 2025
Erika KirkAmerican figure Trump reportedly told to sue over a comedy sketch
Brigitte MacronWife of French President Emmanuel Macron, target of Owens's claims
Megyn KellyConservative broadcaster and podcaster
Ben ShapiroConservative commentator who advocated the Iran war
Jeremy BoringCo-founder and former CEO of The Daily Wire
Bari WeissEditor-in-chief of CBS News, criticized by Wagner over ratings
Nick FuentesAmerican far-right streamer and political commentator
Andrew TateOnline influencer cited as an example of the manosphere
Steve BannonAmerican political strategist who recorded conversations with Epstein
Ashley St. ClairFormer right-wing influencer who has a child with Elon Musk
Bill PulteFHFA director named acting Director of National Intelligence
James O'KeefeFounder of Project Veritas and conservative sting operator
James FishbackAmerica First candidate for governor of Florida
Byron DonaldsTrump-endorsed congressman running for Florida governor
Greg BovinoBorder Patrol official who tried to keep official social media accounts after leaving his post
Hunter BidenSon of Joe Biden, subject of the laptop story
JD VanceVice President of the United States
Sarah LongwellBulwark publisher who runs focus groups

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From the publisher

Will Sommer, author of The Bulwark's "False Flag" newsletter, sits down with Tommy to talk about the MAGA media world — including the right-wing personalities who may be considering a political future (Tucker Carlson and Candace Owens), those whose influence is crumbling (Ben Shapiro), and some of the most troubling — and strangest — rising voices. Tommy and Will then break down the ways some of MAGA's leading voices are abandoning the president, what their world will look like and whether it can even survive in a post-Trump future. For a closed-captioned version of this episode, click here . For a transcript of this episode, please email transcripts@crooked.com and include the name of the podcast, episode title, and episode date.

Summary, chapters and key points were generated from the episode transcript on September 28, 2026. Quotes are checked word for word against the transcript.

Categories: Politics·News Commentary