Pool Me Twice, Shame On You

Episode of Pod Save America · June 23, 2026 · 1 h 39 min

Jon Favreau, Jon Lovett, and Tommy Vietor discuss Iran talks, Trump's Reflecting Pool fiasco, the Qatari jet, and Bill Pulte; Tommy interviews Maggie Haberman and Jonathan Swan about Regime Change.

Summary

The hosts opened with the state of U.S.-Iran peace talks negotiated by JD Vance. Tommy Vietor warned that Iran's threats to reclose the Strait of Hormuz would keep shipping and energy markets unsettled, and argued Trump had surrendered his leverage. Jon Lovett contended the U.S. was worse off than under the JCPOA, and Vietor noted that, contrary to Vance's claim, the JCPOA had shipped 97% of Iran's enriched stockpile out of the country. They reviewed Republican reactions from Lindsey Graham, James Comer and Tucker Carlson, and a CBS poll showing 70% of Americans saw the war as not worth the cost.

The hosts then mocked the failed Reflecting Pool renovation by Trump associate John Cafaro, with Favreau calling Trump's claim of a 300-foot vandal's slit a fabrication and Lovett describing the episode as a metaphor for the administration's lying, corruption and incompetence as federal agents arrested alleged vandals. They discussed the Qatari jet being unveiled as Air Force One, Bill Pulte becoming acting Director of National Intelligence, a Washington Post report that Tulsi Gabbard followed memos from a cult leader, and a New York Times story on the commutation of fraudster David Gentile, which Vietor and Lovett said Democrats should investigate.

In the second half, Vietor interviewed Maggie Haberman and Jonathan Swan about their book Regime Change. Haberman described a fundamentally different second term with loyal staff and cowed institutions; Swan said Trump sees himself as a Napoleonic "great man of history," recounting a document comparing him to history's most powerful rulers that turned out to be written by Gary Player's former caddy. They discussed the Qatari jet, the presidential library fundraising, chaotic Oval Office decision-making, Trump's narrowing information diet, the Epstein files crisis, Trump's ranking of Vance and Rubio, and Steve Witkoff's diplomacy with Vladimir Putin.

Chapters

1:46
Introduction
Favreau previews the episode and the hosts praise the Haberman-Swan book.
3:06
Iran peace talks
The hosts assess the Iran memorandum, sanctions waivers, inspections and Vance's JCPOA claims.
10:45
Republican reactions and CBS poll
Clips of Comer, Graham and Carlson prompt discussion of GOP fractures and polling showing the war is unpopular.
22:27
Reflecting Pool fiasco
The hosts ridicule the failed renovation, Trump's vandalism claims and the resulting arrests.
33:26
Qatari Air Force One
Discussion of the retrofitted Qatari jet, its cost, design and symbolism of corruption.
43:59
Bill Pulte as acting DNI
The hosts discuss why Trump delayed Jay Clayton's confirmation and what Pulte might do at ODNI.
47:05
Tulsi Gabbard cult report
The hosts react to a Washington Post story that Gabbard followed memos from a religious leader.
52:49
David Gentile commutation
The hosts discuss alleged pay-for-clemency efforts and whether Democrats should investigate or impeach.
1:02:21
Interview: Trump's second term
Haberman and Swan explain how Trump 2.0 differs, including the 'great man of history' document.
1:08:34
Corruption, the jet and the library
The authors detail the Qatari jet, crypto deals and presidential library fundraising.
1:17:14
Inside the Oval Office
The authors describe chaotic decision-making, secrecy, and Trump's constricted information diet.
1:25:35
The Epstein files
Swan explains how the staff handled the Epstein crisis and its political damage.
1:29:37
Vance versus Rubio
The authors discuss Trump's public ranking of potential successors.
1:33:08
Witkoff and Russia diplomacy
Swan describes Steve Witkoff's inexperience and approach to Putin and Ukraine.

Key points

What was said, by whom, with the exact words. Timestamps jump to the moment.

Tommy Vietor
Vietor worried that Iran's threats would leave shipping and energy prices unsettled for a long time.
“I'm worried about this just kind of bumping along in an unsettled fashion for a while. I'm worried about ongoing high energy prices”
Listen from 6:19 · Strait of Hormuz
Jon Lovett
Lovett argued the U.S. is worse off than before the Iran war and than under the JCPOA.
“We are worse off than we were before the war started. And we are worse off than we were when there was the JCPOA in place”
Listen from 7:11 · Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action
Tommy Vietor
Vietor argued Trump has given up his leverage over Iran, making a better deal unlikely.
“Trump's leverage is just gone. He's given the sanctions relief. The threat of military action is gone”
Listen from 9:43 · United States war with Iran
Tommy Vietor
Vietor said Vance had it backwards: the JCPOA shipped Iran's stockpile abroad, while the new deal keeps it in-country.
“Under the JCPOA, they shipped out 97% of their stockpile. They went to Russia where they disposed of it”
Listen from 10:34 · Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action
Jon Lovett
Lovett suggested pro-Trump hawks hope to punt on Iran until after the midterms and then resume a bellicose posture.
“they can prevent the worst political blowback from the war, get costs down and then go back to being bellicose regime changers once the midterms are behind us”
Listen from 13:08 · United States war with Iran
Tommy Vietor
Vietor argued presidents are punished politically when they are perceived to have lost a war.
“if you end a war and are perceived to have lost the war, I think voters will punish you”
Listen from 18:12 · United States war with Iran
Jon Favreau
Favreau cautioned that voters expecting quick gas price relief may be disappointed.
“Just because the price of oil is falling doesn't mean that the price of gas will as well”
Listen from 18:45 · Gas prices and inflation
Jon Lovett
Lovett argued Trump turned a small pool story into a metaphor for his administration's failings.
“You just turned it into a perfect metaphor for everything you've done wrong in this administration”
Listen from 26:41 · Lincoln Memorial Reflecting Pool renovation
Jon Favreau
Favreau predicted the Reflecting Pool vandalism arrests will not result in jail time.
“none of these people are going to jail because all of this is going to get laughed out of court”
Listen from 28:54 · Lincoln Memorial Reflecting Pool renovation
Tommy Vietor
Vietor said the Qatari jet has become a symbol of Trump's corruption that damaged his businessman image.
“I think this has really become a monument to the corruption. And it really broke through in the moment”
Listen from 35:12 · Qatari jet gift for Air Force One
Jon Lovett
Lovett warned that Pulte could do significant damage even in a short tenure as acting DNI.
“I think also Bill Pulte can do a lot of damage being DNI for a couple of weeks”
Listen from 45:04 · Office of the Director of National Intelligence
Tommy Vietor
Vietor argued that while Trump is immune over pardons, those selling pardons should be investigated.
“Trump is immune from prosecution around pardons, but the people selling pardons are not. So we should absolutely investigate the hell out of it”
Listen from 55:32 · David Gentile commutation
Jon Lovett
Lovett blamed congressional Republicans for enabling the scale of Trump's corruption.
“They are responsible for this. They are the ones that are enabling this every day”
Listen from 59:15 · Political corruption in the United States
Jon Favreau
Favreau said he was weighing whether a Democratic Congress should impeach Trump over corruption, noting impeachment is the constitutional remedy.
“when he's stealing from the American people, the remedy in the Constitution is to impeach the guy”
Listen from 59:57 · Political corruption in the United States
Linked moment · 1:03:35Skip to 1:03:35 using a listen link in the info box.
Maggie Haberman
Haberman said the book shows Trump's second term is fundamentally different from his first.
“this is just a fundamentally different term than Trump 1. This is a very different presidency”
Listen from 1:03:35 · Regime Change: Inside the Imperial Presidency of Donald Trump
Jonathan Swan
Swan reported that the 'historian' document comparing Trump to history's most powerful rulers was written by a golf caddy.
“It was Gary Player, the golfer's former caddy”
Listen from 1:05:19 · Regime Change: Inside the Imperial Presidency of Donald Trump
Jonathan Swan
Swan argued Trump now cares less about polls and sees himself as a Napoleonic historic figure.
“He views himself and is trying to create this for himself as a capital G great man of history, as a sort of Napoleonic figure”
Listen from 1:06:15 · Regime Change: Inside the Imperial Presidency of Donald Trump
Maggie Haberman
Haberman said the supposedly free Qatari jet has cost taxpayers hundreds of millions in upgrades.
“In fact, it has cost several hundreds of millions of dollars in taxpayer upgrades to make it safe for presidents”
Listen from 1:09:28 · Qatari jet gift for Air Force One
Jonathan Swan
Swan said reporters likely know only a small fraction of the administration's corruption.
“impossible to cover because I truly think we only know 1%, maybe 5% of what's going on”
Listen from 1:13:45 · Political corruption in the United States
Jonathan Swan
Swan recounted Trump saying in the Oval Office that he tolerates Lutnick because of a $25 million library donation.
“the only reason I put up with Howard's bullshit is he gave me $25 million”
Listen from 1:14:22 · Donald J. Trump Presidential Library
Maggie Haberman
Haberman reported that the Energy and Treasury Secretaries were excluded from most meetings before the Iran war due to leak paranoia.
“the Energy Secretary and the Treasury Secretary had not been part of most of the meetings”
Listen from 1:18:10 · United States war with Iran
Jonathan Swan
Swan said Trump's senior staff initially underestimated the political salience of the Epstein files.
“early on senior people on his team underestimated the political salience of this issue”
Listen from 1:26:35 · Jeffrey Epstein
Jonathan Swan
Swan identified the Epstein controversy last summer as the start of Trump's political decline.
“Last summer is when Trump's political fortunes really started to decline”
Listen from 1:27:48 · Jeffrey Epstein
Maggie Haberman
Haberman said that despite Trump's games, Vance remains the prohibitive frontrunner for the GOP succession.
“It's hard to look at the existing fundamentals of the modern Republican Party and the MAGA movement and not see how J.D. Vance is still very much the prohibitive frontrunner”
Listen from 1:31:51 · 2028 Republican Party presidential primaries
Jonathan Swan
Swan said senior Trump officials, including Witkoff, share a contempt for subject-matter expertise.
“There is a commonality at the most senior levels of Trump world, which is a contempt for subject matter expertise and subject matter experts”
Listen from 1:34:56 · Russian invasion of Ukraine

People

In the conversation

Jon FavreauCo-host of Pod Save America and former speechwriter for President Barack Obama
Tommy VietorCo-host of Pod Save America and Pod Save the World who conducted the Josh Turek interview
Jon LovettCo-host of Pod Save America; diarization split of the same speaker during the economics segment
Maggie HabermanNew York Times reporter and co-author of Regime Change
Jonathan SwanNew York Times reporter and co-author of Regime Change

Discussed

JD VanceVice President of the United States
John CafaroTrump associate and convicted felon awarded the Reflecting Pool contract
James ComeyFormer FBI director cited as another target of unusual federal prosecution
Bill PulteFHFA director named acting Director of National Intelligence
Tulsi GabbardDirector of National Intelligence
Jay ClaytonU.S. attorney and former SEC chair nominated as Director of National Intelligence
Mark WarnerDemocratic U.S. senator from Virginia who called the data center moratorium idiocy
David GentileConvicted fraudster whose sentence Trump commuted
Steve WitkoffU.S. envoy conducting negotiations with Iran
Vladimir PutinPresident of Russia
Natalie HarpClose Trump aide described by Jiang as writing Trump's social media posts
Howard LutnickCantor Fitzgerald executive who was absent from the World Trade Center on 9/11
Marco RubioU.S. Secretary of State who defended the Iran campaign at a cabinet meeting
Rupert MurdochMedia mogul cited as pushing for the war
Keith KelloggTrump's original Russia-Ukraine envoy
Eric TrumpSon of Donald Trump

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From the publisher

Donald Trump says the Reflecting Pool will need to be drained for repairs to the coating he said would "last for at least 50 years" — blaming vandals for the peeling and algae blooms that have turned his pet project into an instant mess, and ordering federal agents to start making arrests. Jon, Tommy, and Lovett react to the administration's scapegoating then turn to the rest of the news, including the latest from JD Vance's negotiations with Iran, Trump's luxurious renovation of the Qatari jet set to become the new Air Force One, and the beginning of Bill Pulte's term as acting Director of National Intelligence. Then, New York Times reporters Maggie Haberman and Jonathan Swan join Tommy to discuss their new book, "Regime Change: Inside the Imperial Presidency of Donald Trump," which offers an unparalleled look inside Trump's second term. For a closed-captioned version of this episode, click here . For a transcript of this episode, please email transcripts@crooked.com and include the name of the podcast, episode title, and episode date.

Summary, chapters and key points were generated from the episode transcript on September 29, 2026. Quotes are checked word for word against the transcript.

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